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Seperate troll life count.
- Thread starter thedorado
- Start date
He may not be able to predict it 100%, but quite a few people on this forums would, like him, be able to predict whether or not this will be implemented.
Mass_Explosive
New member
Many of you probably don't realize this, but a while back, I think like over a year ago, Tim tried to remove troll from Helms deep because it was unrealistic there. He tried putting a ram at the gate, but it wouldn't fit on the walkway. After that he tried to make it where orcs could bash the gate, but that ended crashing the server, twice. My point is that Tim has tried to make it so Orc soldiers can bash gates but failed. It really was too hard to code. Also, Giving troll a life count would be hard to determine what an appropriate number would be. How many trolls die in a game? What happens if all the trolls die before a gate is breached?
However, I will say that on some maps this could work, but lets take a look at those maps.
Moria Gold: Goblins counter to Longbeard and Hammerer
Morgul: Easily beaten in an open courtyard by 2-3 attackers and after 1st flag impractical to use
Moria: Used to bash gate to Balin's tomb and to provide a bulky non-donor class for Goblins
Helm's Deep: Used to bash gate
Erebor: Used to bash gates
These are the five maps I think that this idea would be most feasible. Moria Gold is meant to be a capture the flag game, not a conquest style fight, so limiting trolls would encourage attackers to grab the gold more instead of just fighting.
Morgul: Not sure how the re-vamped morgul is going to be, but in its current state trolls are really just targets. They always get ganged up on by 2-3 soldiers, targeted by archers and so on. Along with their slowness they can't help too much, unless of course they sit at the top of the first flag and kill people.
Moria: Trolls provide an arrow absorbent for the first flag where Dwarves have a ridiculous advantage. Afterward their KB and strength clear the next two flags, then they bash the gate down into balin's tomb. Afterwards, it usually becomes a stalemate at the staircase due to hammerer vs troll and goblin's KB. Limiting could work since there are two paths into the tombs, but it would make it much more difficult if the trolls died before that point, unless there is a balrog on.
Helm's Deep: Probably the most likely of places for this to happen. Isengard never had trolls, but we have them there because they are used to bash the gates. Sadly, like the problems I stated above, removing trolls isn't possible, and if all the trolls die before they breach the keep, well GG. I will say that is very unlikely that'll ever happen, but just stating that fact.
Erebor: Besides the iron bar gates in Erebor, trolls aren't necessary. Erebor is large enough where they aren't too much of a threat due to having plenty of space to run away from them. They could be limited here and similar to Helm's deep would only be dying out late, if ever, in the game.
This idea could work, but only on select maps, and even if it is implemented, it'll have to be tweeked quite often.
However, I will say that on some maps this could work, but lets take a look at those maps.
Moria Gold: Goblins counter to Longbeard and Hammerer
Morgul: Easily beaten in an open courtyard by 2-3 attackers and after 1st flag impractical to use
Moria: Used to bash gate to Balin's tomb and to provide a bulky non-donor class for Goblins
Helm's Deep: Used to bash gate
Erebor: Used to bash gates
These are the five maps I think that this idea would be most feasible. Moria Gold is meant to be a capture the flag game, not a conquest style fight, so limiting trolls would encourage attackers to grab the gold more instead of just fighting.
Morgul: Not sure how the re-vamped morgul is going to be, but in its current state trolls are really just targets. They always get ganged up on by 2-3 soldiers, targeted by archers and so on. Along with their slowness they can't help too much, unless of course they sit at the top of the first flag and kill people.
Moria: Trolls provide an arrow absorbent for the first flag where Dwarves have a ridiculous advantage. Afterward their KB and strength clear the next two flags, then they bash the gate down into balin's tomb. Afterwards, it usually becomes a stalemate at the staircase due to hammerer vs troll and goblin's KB. Limiting could work since there are two paths into the tombs, but it would make it much more difficult if the trolls died before that point, unless there is a balrog on.
Helm's Deep: Probably the most likely of places for this to happen. Isengard never had trolls, but we have them there because they are used to bash the gates. Sadly, like the problems I stated above, removing trolls isn't possible, and if all the trolls die before they breach the keep, well GG. I will say that is very unlikely that'll ever happen, but just stating that fact.
Erebor: Besides the iron bar gates in Erebor, trolls aren't necessary. Erebor is large enough where they aren't too much of a threat due to having plenty of space to run away from them. They could be limited here and similar to Helm's deep would only be dying out late, if ever, in the game.
This idea could work, but only on select maps, and even if it is implemented, it'll have to be tweeked quite often.
Moria Gold: Yes I agree that they should be limited here.. (it pains me to say). I can get ridiculous killstreaks, and if there are about 4 effective trolls, they just completely block the dwarves from leaving their spawn.
Morgul: At the moment, if the Gondor team are organised, trolls can be easily destroyed if they go in front of the gate. Same with the courtyard - and of course they aren't allowed up the tower. I don't think it is necessary here.
Moria: Again, I can get really high killstreaks here - and any old noob could probably do similarly. The problem is, Trolls hardly ever die on Moria
Helm's Deep: No kill count, but REDUCE THE DAMN TROLL CAP!!!!! When there are like 30 people on you can get about 11 trolls! Its ridiculous! Change it to like on Erebor. The ratio should be about 1:10 I think.
Erebor: No need for it here. Because the spaces are so wide open, trolls are no threat - unless you run into their arms like an idiot.
But all of this raises the question... is there really a point implementing it on some maps, but not others? Far too complicated and confusing I think. And obviously it shouldn't be implemented on all maps.
So don't implement a life count at all. Just reduce the cap, especially on Helm's.
Morgul: At the moment, if the Gondor team are organised, trolls can be easily destroyed if they go in front of the gate. Same with the courtyard - and of course they aren't allowed up the tower. I don't think it is necessary here.
Moria: Again, I can get really high killstreaks here - and any old noob could probably do similarly. The problem is, Trolls hardly ever die on Moria
Helm's Deep: No kill count, but REDUCE THE DAMN TROLL CAP!!!!! When there are like 30 people on you can get about 11 trolls! Its ridiculous! Change it to like on Erebor. The ratio should be about 1:10 I think.
Erebor: No need for it here. Because the spaces are so wide open, trolls are no threat - unless you run into their arms like an idiot.
But all of this raises the question... is there really a point implementing it on some maps, but not others? Far too complicated and confusing I think. And obviously it shouldn't be implemented on all maps.
So don't implement a life count at all. Just reduce the cap, especially on Helm's.
You meant 30 people on Mordor. But there's rarely such a number on.
The problem on Morgul is that Trolls spawn so close to the gate, so if you kill them, they are back within seconds.
The problem on Morgul is that Trolls spawn so close to the gate, so if you kill them, they are back within seconds.[/quote]
The problem on Morgul is that Trolls spawn so close to the gate, so if you kill them, they are back within seconds.[/quote]
Thats true, when I want to raise my KD I just simply play troll on Minas Tirith or Morgul. On Tirith trolls are fine because they are needed to bash through every gate. On Morgul they are just a nuisance to Gondor and make it very hard for the team to go through the first gate let alone the other three flags.